Vrenille already knows the utter futility of that answer even as he gives it. Clearly Riddler doesn't care about it from any sort of moral perspective, and he's pretty sure Oswald isn't going to give a rat's ass either. And yet--
"I...kinda feel like, y'know, maybe you guys should tell me if you're killing people?"
Yup, this conversation sure has completely gotten away from him not even a minute in.
Riddler tilts his head slightly and very clearly doesn't get it. "Well... it's not like it was premeditated. Oswald just sort of... blew his top because he thought Ed or both of us were going to run off with some random woman. And we cleaned up."
"...Why would he ever think that you'd--?" He shakes his head. Whether they're talking about Riddler or Ed, the thought of either of them running off with a random woman now, at this point...but then clearly Oswald wasn't at his most level-headed during that whole wings phase.
"Look, I'm glad that you kept him outta trouble, really. That's a relief." He's sure none of them want to see Oswald hauled off to the People Zoo.
"I'm just worried 'bout the impulse control. What if you weren't there to clean things up for him?" Translation: he's troubled by random, senseless murder and Oswald lashing out lethally the moment his feathers get a little ruffled.
Riddler shrugs. "Apparently, Ed did it before. According to Oswald. He was definitely not thinking clearly." Oswald has been emotional, but never to the detriment of business like that.
"I'm fairly sure the city was affecting him. And... where else would I be?"
"The woman who he--" vague hand gesture. "Yeah, I remember, but that's nothing like--!" Oh sod it. There's no reason to try and argue how irrational the fear was when they've already established, precisely, that it is irrational.
Not thinking clearly is putting it lightly, but, "Look my point is he can't go off killing people just 'cause he's not thinking clearly! And anyway, you can't be with him every minute of the day."
It scarcely needs saying, he thinks, since obviously Riddler is here right now and Oswald is out somewhere on his own. It's not as though his relationship with Ed and Riddler mean that Oswald has stopped living an independent life.
They have established that there was nothing rational or even vaguely logical about Oswald's outrage and jealousy.
"It's less that I can't and more that we both choose that I not be. Ed would probably quite happily follow Oswald around all day with a lack of anything else in his life, which was another hilarious piece of the hypocrisy of that day, but I digress. Oswald has things to do, people to see, and I would go mind numbingly bored and start taking drugs recreationally to try and alleviate the incessant screaming of my own mind. And really, if the city didn't want things like this to happen, they shouldn't orchestrate it to, should they?"
"I think you'd both drive each other batty," Vrenille mutters, half to himself, as he shakes his head. Ultimately, though, he just has to sigh, deeply. Very deeply. It's hard to argue with Riddler placing the blame squarely at the city's feet that way.
"Yeah, yeah I guess," it's true, but he doesn't like it. And he doesn't like his suspicion that trying to confront Oswald about this would lead him no farther than he's gotten with Riddler. At any rate, he's not getting anywhere with it now, so he just accepts it as beyond his control and changes the subject.
Riddler gives a small half shrug. They might drive each other insane, it's true. While they have a lot of overlap in things they enjoy, they also need time away from one another when the little habits and foibles start to get annoying.
Oswald especially needs time away from Ed and Riddler. They can be a bit much.
"Huh. I'm... not really sure what to say. I know you missed him, but I guess you didn't really want him back here to be your reunion?"
"Hell, he's my best friend and I'm not really sure what to say." Vrenille rubs his brow with one hand and finds a free stool to perch on.
"I'm glad to see him, glad he's back, I guess in a selfish sorta way. But--" Where should he even start? He's certainly not going to try and unburden himself to Riddler. That would be an exercise in poor judgement if ever there was one. Ed, at least, would try to be slightly more empathetic, but maybe that's not even the point. On a strictly informational level, he supposes there are some things they should know.
"That's who I was talking to in that message you got from me--the one I didn't mean to send. It's something I said to Hakkyuu a couple days ago...'bout the guy he's gone 'n contracted with, actually."
Riddler gives Vrenille his proper attention. He looks him over for a moment, trying to read what Vrenille thinks or feels about this. "I see. He's got a contract. And the guy is what, possessive? Territorial? Do you need him sorted out?"
Honestly, coming from Riddler, that's probably one of the most loyal and thoughtful reactions he could hope for, and it makes Vrenille smile at him with a strange sort of fondness.
"No, no nothing like that. The guy's...I dunno, maybe a bit of a trouble maker, but then so's Hakkyuu. He likes to get under people's skin, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised if he's managed to hook up with someone who'll do a bit of the same."
So no sorting out is necessary. He just wants to make sure they're all communicating--if he doesn't want Ed or Oswald to keep him in the dark, he's got to extend them the same courtesy.
"You, uh, might've seen the guy on the network not too long ago. There was a video of him...in jail for a citation he didn't pay." If Riddler's seen it, Vrenille thinks, he'll probably know right away. "It was...pretty brutal."
"I know Hakkyuu likes to get under people's skin. He talked with Ed, remember?" And Ed had reacted badly. He was still coming out of his very tightly self imposed closet at that point, waiting for someone to beat him back into it.
Riddler's expression darkens slightly before it smooths away. "I don't watch them. I like information as much as any Gothamite, but there are limits. I won't help the city humiliate and punish and uphold their depravities on us." And if refusing to watch people being tortured is all he can do... it's something he will do.
"Oh, I remember. I always reckoned you 'n him 'd get along better than him 'n Ed would anyway." Maybe now, though, it would be different. Maybe the way that Ed's come out of his shell a bit since Oswald's been here, since they've both been contracted with Vrenille--maybe all of that will make Hakkyuu a less antagonistic figure. Or at least make for a more enjoyable form of antagonism.
"And I don't blame you, really. I watched it 'cause I knew Hakkyuu was gonna be watching it. Trickle-down need to know sorta thing. Anyway, the guy's called Logan. Short like Hakkyuu, all muscle, big ole mutton chops, smokes cigars. I don't guess he's got any cause to show up here, but so you know him, just in case. Honestly, he seems like a real prick, but I'm trying to be nice for Hakkyuu's sake."
"I understand feeling the need to watch in your circumstances." Vrenille wanted to support Hakkyuu and Hakkyuu would torment himself by watching. "If he turns up, Ed will feed him and get hold of you."
Was there anything else he could do, really? "He's not smoking in the house. Cigars are vile at the best of times." For someone with his sensitivities to sensory input, the lingering smell would drive him crazy.
"Thanks. To both of you," he means that honestly. It's about the best reassurance and...well, support, he can hope for under the circumstances. "Here's to hoping he's got better manners as a houseguest than he fronts like he does."
It's not lost on Vrenille that some of his initial poor impressions of Logan might be based on the man's intentional projecting of a whole spate of off-putting performatives. Maybe even the cigars--who knows if he didn't take up the habit specifically because so many people would agree that it's vile.
Considering the matter as settled as they can make it, Vrenille is starting to push himself back to his feet to let Riddler get back to work when he remembers the whole other matter he'd wanted to speak to him about.
"Oh, hey, that's right--I was gonna tell you: remember when we talked--well, me 'n Ed talked--'bout him getting bored, wanting some more interesting work to do? Well, I've been talking to the guys in the forensics section in the Down, and I finally got an okay. There's a job for you there if you want it. They're not gonna pay you great or give you much of a title, but it's real lab 'n field work, not just sweeping up. Maybe help Ed find a bit of an outlet."
Everything else is short circuited by the announcement that he can work forensics. He can work in science again, and it will be in a shit hole place with as good as no pay but it will be something to do.
"R-real lab work." Not just mixing pharmaceuticals for his own amusement. Ed swallows, trying to wrap his mind around that. "You convinced them to let me do actual work."
It’s good news—some of the best news Vrenille’s had the chance to deliver in quite a while, and given everything else they’ve just been speaking of, it’s something of a balm.
“Yeah,” he nods with a smile as he lets Ed’s reaction wash over him like a warm patch of sunshine, a temporary break in the clouds.
“Real lab work. We’re both citizens now, we’ve got a contract, we’re in good standing, no citations. Far as the city’s concerned we’ve assimilated ‘bout as well as anyone can to this world. All ‘bout appearances, really—far as they’re concerned, you’re gonna work there ‘cause I like the idea,” he shrugs. “But so what—who cares what they think’s the reason.”
Ed bites his bottom lip and sways on the spot, excited and happy and feeling pathetically grateful for the chance to do something that isn't the same boring thing but promises to at least change each day.
"Like when Riddler was particularly obnoxious at the restaurant and they tried to get snooty." And Vrenille had said he liked Riddler just how he was. "I'm banned from going back there. I let myself in through the exit and my photo was up behind the door for the entrance to not be allowed back." In the excitement, he's slipping for plural to singular more than he has in a while.
Vrenille did like Riddler like he was that night--he still likes him, in fact. Not that he doesn't sometimes drive Vrenille to distraction and leave him feeling like he needs a good stiff drink. Sometimes Oswald and Ed do that too. For Vrenille, though, that's just another thing he likes about them, not at all something he'd want to change.
The reminiscence makes him chuckle. "That was a good night. Least you made a lasting impression."
Personally, Vrenille has always been a more-flies-with-honey type of person, but he knows that Riddler, in particular, isn't like that. Riddler likes to leave his mark, his calling card, and Vrenille has never begrudged him doing so. Maybe it's all just a matter of how he does it, and maybe in a sense, working in forensics gives him and Ed another way--the mark of their intellect on the crime puzzles they solve rather than crime puzzles they make.
Smiling up at Ed, Vrenille moves to step closer, reaching an affectionate hand to cup his cheek. "Do it in reverse here, yeah? Don't make 'em wanna keep you out, make 'em wonder how they ever did without you."
Riddler that night had felt a little less pessimistic about Duplicity. For a while. He was on a high, enjoying the chance to stretch his mind and prove his intellectual prowess.
"I did that last time. Solved crime rates plummeted once they arrested me. It was satisfying, or would have been, if they'd realised why they suddenly sucked more." He huffs a small breath. "I don't do well with not getting recognition." He needs people to tell him he's doing well. He remembers the first time that Detective Bullock told him how well he did. It had been unprompted and honest and had felt-
He closes his eyes and tips his cheek into the touch. "Thank you."
Recognition from just Vrenille and Oswald may not be quite the same as recognition from the world, but maybe at least it can be something. And maybe even if the crime lab here is chary with their praise for anyone marked who works there, they'll all come to appreciate and value to contributions Ed can make, his unique skill and brilliance.
The bottom line is it's a chance, and in this place, a chance can be quite a lot.
"Make me proud, Ed," Vrenille says, knowing full well that probably no one has ever said it to him before. "I know you will." Because he has faith in him, he believes in him, and he already knows what a credit he is to everything he puts his mind to.
For Ed, that personal attention and recognition is probably enough. If people where he works are willing to recognise his brilliance and hard work, it just might put Ed over of the moon.
(Riddler makes no such promises. Riddler hungers for more of everything that Ed ever wanted.)
Only one person ever gave Ed a chance before and every idiot with a single working sense can tell how devoted Ed is to Oswald for giving him that chance. For trusting his brilliance. So Ed just nods, chewing on his lower lip for a moment, eyes wide behind his glasses. He will. He will do his utmost.
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timeasmymeasure
no subject
Date: 2021-03-27 08:00 am (UTC)Vrenille already knows the utter futility of that answer even as he gives it. Clearly Riddler doesn't care about it from any sort of moral perspective, and he's pretty sure Oswald isn't going to give a rat's ass either. And yet--
"I...kinda feel like, y'know, maybe you guys should tell me if you're killing people?"
Yup, this conversation sure has completely gotten away from him not even a minute in.
no subject
Date: 2021-03-27 08:04 am (UTC)What more do you want, Vrenille?
no subject
Date: 2021-03-27 08:15 am (UTC)"Look, I'm glad that you kept him outta trouble, really. That's a relief." He's sure none of them want to see Oswald hauled off to the People Zoo.
"I'm just worried 'bout the impulse control. What if you weren't there to clean things up for him?" Translation: he's troubled by random, senseless murder and Oswald lashing out lethally the moment his feathers get a little ruffled.
no subject
Date: 2021-03-27 08:59 am (UTC)"I'm fairly sure the city was affecting him. And... where else would I be?"
no subject
Date: 2021-03-31 08:28 am (UTC)Not thinking clearly is putting it lightly, but, "Look my point is he can't go off killing people just 'cause he's not thinking clearly! And anyway, you can't be with him every minute of the day."
It scarcely needs saying, he thinks, since obviously Riddler is here right now and Oswald is out somewhere on his own. It's not as though his relationship with Ed and Riddler mean that Oswald has stopped living an independent life.
no subject
Date: 2021-03-31 09:05 am (UTC)"It's less that I can't and more that we both choose that I not be. Ed would probably quite happily follow Oswald around all day with a lack of anything else in his life, which was another hilarious piece of the hypocrisy of that day, but I digress. Oswald has things to do, people to see, and I would go mind numbingly bored and start taking drugs recreationally to try and alleviate the incessant screaming of my own mind. And really, if the city didn't want things like this to happen, they shouldn't orchestrate it to, should they?"
no subject
Date: 2021-04-02 06:58 am (UTC)"Yeah, yeah I guess," it's true, but he doesn't like it. And he doesn't like his suspicion that trying to confront Oswald about this would lead him no farther than he's gotten with Riddler. At any rate, he's not getting anywhere with it now, so he just accepts it as beyond his control and changes the subject.
"By the way, Hakkyuu's back in town."
no subject
Date: 2021-04-02 07:08 am (UTC)Oswald especially needs time away from Ed and Riddler. They can be a bit much.
"Huh. I'm... not really sure what to say. I know you missed him, but I guess you didn't really want him back here to be your reunion?"
no subject
Date: 2021-04-02 08:53 am (UTC)"I'm glad to see him, glad he's back, I guess in a selfish sorta way. But--" Where should he even start? He's certainly not going to try and unburden himself to Riddler. That would be an exercise in poor judgement if ever there was one. Ed, at least, would try to be slightly more empathetic, but maybe that's not even the point. On a strictly informational level, he supposes there are some things they should know.
"That's who I was talking to in that message you got from me--the one I didn't mean to send. It's something I said to Hakkyuu a couple days ago...'bout the guy he's gone 'n contracted with, actually."
no subject
Date: 2021-04-02 09:03 am (UTC)It's well intentioned at least.
no subject
Date: 2021-04-02 09:15 am (UTC)"No, no nothing like that. The guy's...I dunno, maybe a bit of a trouble maker, but then so's Hakkyuu. He likes to get under people's skin, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised if he's managed to hook up with someone who'll do a bit of the same."
So no sorting out is necessary. He just wants to make sure they're all communicating--if he doesn't want Ed or Oswald to keep him in the dark, he's got to extend them the same courtesy.
"You, uh, might've seen the guy on the network not too long ago. There was a video of him...in jail for a citation he didn't pay." If Riddler's seen it, Vrenille thinks, he'll probably know right away. "It was...pretty brutal."
no subject
Date: 2021-04-02 09:40 am (UTC)Riddler's expression darkens slightly before it smooths away. "I don't watch them. I like information as much as any Gothamite, but there are limits. I won't help the city humiliate and punish and uphold their depravities on us." And if refusing to watch people being tortured is all he can do... it's something he will do.
no subject
Date: 2021-04-08 08:34 am (UTC)"And I don't blame you, really. I watched it 'cause I knew Hakkyuu was gonna be watching it. Trickle-down need to know sorta thing. Anyway, the guy's called Logan. Short like Hakkyuu, all muscle, big ole mutton chops, smokes cigars. I don't guess he's got any cause to show up here, but so you know him, just in case. Honestly, he seems like a real prick, but I'm trying to be nice for Hakkyuu's sake."
Trying. Logan is not making it easy.
no subject
Date: 2021-04-08 09:53 am (UTC)Was there anything else he could do, really? "He's not smoking in the house. Cigars are vile at the best of times." For someone with his sensitivities to sensory input, the lingering smell would drive him crazy.
no subject
Date: 2021-04-12 10:44 am (UTC)It's not lost on Vrenille that some of his initial poor impressions of Logan might be based on the man's intentional projecting of a whole spate of off-putting performatives. Maybe even the cigars--who knows if he didn't take up the habit specifically because so many people would agree that it's vile.
Considering the matter as settled as they can make it, Vrenille is starting to push himself back to his feet to let Riddler get back to work when he remembers the whole other matter he'd wanted to speak to him about.
"Oh, hey, that's right--I was gonna tell you: remember when we talked--well, me 'n Ed talked--'bout him getting bored, wanting some more interesting work to do? Well, I've been talking to the guys in the forensics section in the Down, and I finally got an okay. There's a job for you there if you want it. They're not gonna pay you great or give you much of a title, but it's real lab 'n field work, not just sweeping up. Maybe help Ed find a bit of an outlet."
no subject
Date: 2021-04-13 01:56 am (UTC)"R-real lab work." Not just mixing pharmaceuticals for his own amusement. Ed swallows, trying to wrap his mind around that. "You convinced them to let me do actual work."
no subject
Date: 2021-04-13 12:48 pm (UTC)“Yeah,” he nods with a smile as he lets Ed’s reaction wash over him like a warm patch of sunshine, a temporary break in the clouds.
“Real lab work. We’re both citizens now, we’ve got a contract, we’re in good standing, no citations. Far as the city’s concerned we’ve assimilated ‘bout as well as anyone can to this world. All ‘bout appearances, really—far as they’re concerned, you’re gonna work there ‘cause I like the idea,” he shrugs. “But so what—who cares what they think’s the reason.”
no subject
Date: 2021-04-14 10:57 am (UTC)"Like when Riddler was particularly obnoxious at the restaurant and they tried to get snooty." And Vrenille had said he liked Riddler just how he was. "I'm banned from going back there. I let myself in through the exit and my photo was up behind the door for the entrance to not be allowed back." In the excitement, he's slipping for plural to singular more than he has in a while.
no subject
Date: 2021-04-16 08:20 am (UTC)The reminiscence makes him chuckle. "That was a good night. Least you made a lasting impression."
Personally, Vrenille has always been a more-flies-with-honey type of person, but he knows that Riddler, in particular, isn't like that. Riddler likes to leave his mark, his calling card, and Vrenille has never begrudged him doing so. Maybe it's all just a matter of how he does it, and maybe in a sense, working in forensics gives him and Ed another way--the mark of their intellect on the crime puzzles they solve rather than crime puzzles they make.
Smiling up at Ed, Vrenille moves to step closer, reaching an affectionate hand to cup his cheek. "Do it in reverse here, yeah? Don't make 'em wanna keep you out, make 'em wonder how they ever did without you."
no subject
Date: 2021-04-16 09:03 am (UTC)"I did that last time. Solved crime rates plummeted once they arrested me. It was satisfying, or would have been, if they'd realised why they suddenly sucked more." He huffs a small breath. "I don't do well with not getting recognition." He needs people to tell him he's doing well. He remembers the first time that Detective Bullock told him how well he did. It had been unprompted and honest and had felt-
He closes his eyes and tips his cheek into the touch. "Thank you."
no subject
Date: 2021-04-17 08:13 am (UTC)The bottom line is it's a chance, and in this place, a chance can be quite a lot.
"Make me proud, Ed," Vrenille says, knowing full well that probably no one has ever said it to him before. "I know you will." Because he has faith in him, he believes in him, and he already knows what a credit he is to everything he puts his mind to.
no subject
Date: 2021-04-20 02:11 am (UTC)(Riddler makes no such promises. Riddler hungers for more of everything that Ed ever wanted.)
Only one person ever gave Ed a chance before and every idiot with a single working sense can tell how devoted Ed is to Oswald for giving him that chance. For trusting his brilliance. So Ed just nods, chewing on his lower lip for a moment, eyes wide behind his glasses. He will. He will do his utmost.